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SARS in the Chinese countryside

Posted on 04/26/2003 7:01:51 AM PDT by Ma Li

I'm an American living in the countryside of China. I've been in this country for four years now.

I've also lived in Beijing, Shenyang and Shenzhen. I have friends, foreign and Chinese, all over the country, who have also clued me in to the situation where they are. I apologize for the length of this, but hope it is will be informative.

I've been asked by several freepers to start a separate thread on the situation in China, outside of the well known places like Shanghai, Hong Kong and Beijing. I've been posting comments on this subject for a while now, and you can find them through my screen name, I'm sure. So, here goes:

HUBEI PROVINCE

The town I live in is not far from Wuhan, in Hubei province. The official word is that there are no cases in Hubei, except a couple in the capital, Wuhan. Information is tight, and as many of you have probably guessed, despite official claims of forthrightness, the central government still considers this a matter of internal security, and is still reluctant to reveal all of the truth. As for this province, my friends in the hospitals here in this city have informed me they definitely have cases of SARS. In an even smaller village about an hour from here, a class of high school seniors volunteered that there were "no SARS cases in their class."

"That's great, but what about in the rest of the school?"

"Um," they replied, "maybe."

The school's administration, however, has consistently told people they will close the school if even one case shows up. Everywhere, people are wearing masks, and everywhere they are disinfecting.

What is disinfecting? Key to understanding this is to understand two things about Chinese society: their ideas of germs and their ideas about work. ALthough the Chinese are clean, they are clean according to the understanding they have. In the countryside--almost everywhere, and even somewhat in the big cities--they do not understand germs very well. They believe things are clean when rinsed with water, never cover their mouths when coughing or sneezing, spit and blow their nose into public places and all manner of similar things. So, trying get them to understand these new ideas about cleanliness is difficult, to say the least, and especially among the older folks.

The second part--their ideas about work--also play into this. Most large entities or businesses hire far more people then are really essential to the operation of that business. This is because there are so many people--to provide enough jobs there have to be a lot of "make-work" jobs. IN Beijing, for example, in order to benefit smaller provinces, all schools and businesses are required to hire 24's worth hour guards from poor provinces and the countryside. Those guards work many hours a day, live in a shack on the business property, have their meals provided at the canteen, along with their uniform, and anywhere from 1-10RMB a day. (That's about $.12 to $1.24). It's not much, but then, many of these folks do no actual work. So, at a business of any kind you will find not only guards, but a separate person for each job--there is no "secretary" that does many things. There is one man who only makes copies. Another that only types headings on papers. Another that only drives the company car, etc.

So, when you hear that everything is being "disinfected," you have to bear in mind that what is happening is that people who normal spent the vast majority of the working day either smoking, sleeping, chatting or reading the newspaper, are now being ordered to spend all day disinfecting things. HUman nature being what it is, who would want to increase their work load 100% for 0% increase in pay? The result is a haphazd job in many places. Not knowing much about hygiene, many "disinfectors" only spray down the floors of a place with bleach water. They don't wipe anytthing, they don't spray doors, windows that are opened and closed, handles, faucets or knobs. Unless people are licking the floors with their tongues, the current method of disinfecting in this area is pretty much useless. I've heard similar comments from many other foreign friends throughout the country.

In Wuhan, there are one or two admitted cases, but the situation is almost assuredly much worse. Aty least one of the universities has stopped classes for now, and many people are leaving the city. A Chinese friend of mine who studies there says that she knows 40 people have died there from SARS. Of course, that might be panic on her part, and where there is little information, people will always assume the worst because that's the only way to keep safe. This has caused a lot of people to leave Wuhan for their surrounding countryside, ensuriing that there will be more spread.

Foreigners here in this province are not being specifically urged to go, but are being given every help if they wish to do so.

LIAONING PROVINCE:

In Dalian, the vacation retreat for China's elite, a friend working at a school there has let me know the situation at that college. The students claim there are cases at that very school, and have many of them stopped coming to class. Those who do are masked and ready. However, the school officials are telling their foreign teachers that not only are their no cases at the school, but not even any in the whole province. At the same time, constant disinfection is being done on the campus, and they are also being told they are not allowed to leave the school unaccompanied, to travel anywhere in China, or to have guests in their homes. They are also being told they are not free to go home--and that they will be accused of breach of contract if they try.

One of the foreign teachers has a relative back home is quite ill with cancer. The teacher had planned to go home for the May 1 holiday and see him. When the holiday was cancelled, this teacher continued with the plan--the tickets were already bought. The teacher was called in and the school tried to force the teacher to remain in China and teach through the holiday. When the teacher put up a big enough stink, they relented, but saved face by calling the teacher into the president's office, specially, so that he could inform them that they, "in their kindness, had decided that the teacher would be allowed to go home."

This is just one example of how a "policy" handed down by the central government, is ignored, mutated, accepted or turned to personal benefit by the different provincial and local governments and businesses. Down in my province, where there "is no SARS" the students and everyone has holiday from May 1 to May 5, regardless of the directive, because that is what people want. In Liaoning, which also "has no SARS," this school is working straight through, without even one day off on May 1, undoubtedly so they can get more work out of their teachers and more money from their students. (private schools here are a real racket).

GUANG DONG PROVINCE

I have friends working in a small city there. They report that where they are there is almost no information concerning what is going on, and that very few wear masks. The next city over has been quarantined (the entire city). But, despite all that has happened, people in the smaller countryside areas seem largely unaware of SARS and its potential

An American group is still planning to continue their summer teaching program in this city. They'll be bringing 18-22 year old college students to Beijing, and then to Guang Dong for about 4 weeks. Nothing we can say will convince them of the idiocy of this plan. They are determined, and we can only hope that the US will stop flights to China for a time.

HEBEI PROVINCE

There is a small village here, called Xuan Hua. If you look for it on the map, you probably can't find it. It is a couple hours from Beijing. It's also home to a lot of the Falun Gong re-education camps. Although there are very few people there, and very little interaction, relatively, with the "outside world," there are 6 cases that my friends know of, personally. There really are no hospitals here--just clinics. What is happening with these patients, what hope they have. Who knows?


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: china; sars
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1 posted on 04/26/2003 7:01:51 AM PDT by Ma Li
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To: Ma Li
I wonder, could "SARS" be a Chinese BIO weapon experiment that "got out of the bottle?" Just a thought.......
2 posted on 04/26/2003 7:07:51 AM PDT by TominPA (Call me a soldier, retired is optional......)
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To: Ma Li
Thanks for posting this.
3 posted on 04/26/2003 7:10:31 AM PDT by Raymond Hendrix
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To: Ma Li
Thanks! Marked for later..
4 posted on 04/26/2003 7:13:01 AM PDT by AntiGuv (™)
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To: Ma Li
Thank you so much for your reports. I'll have to look at a map of China to figure out where the places you mention are located.

Are you committed to staying there, or might you leave the country until this is under control?

5 posted on 04/26/2003 7:20:52 AM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Ma Li
Thank you and stay safe.
6 posted on 04/26/2003 7:21:12 AM PDT by lonestar (Don't mess with Texans)
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To: TominPA; Ma Li
I can't help but wonder if SARS isn't a ruthless form of population control.

China will never be the same.
7 posted on 04/26/2003 7:22:57 AM PDT by Domestic Church (AMDG...)
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To: TominPA
I really don't know. A scientist or bioweapons engineer might be the one to ask. I can't discount it. Sure, anthrax or something like that might be faster and affect more people, but what could be better then a disease that changes so fast it can barely be kept up with? What better way not only to kill people, but also to cripple economies?
8 posted on 04/26/2003 7:32:30 AM PDT by Ma Li (Never confuse excess of information for freedom of information)
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To: Ma Li
Thanks, Ma Li, this is interesting. Also worrisome. There just could be a huge tragedy developing in China -- a tragedy that could be mitigated if the government didn't control information so tightly. Whatever harm comes to the Chinese economy due to the SARS scare, it'll be far worse in every way if they fail to deal with the threat forthrightly, and a pandemic develops. The Chinese government should be encouraging the involvement of international organizations in monitoring and fighting the spread of SARS in the country.

Please be careful, friend, and be well.

9 posted on 04/26/2003 7:33:57 AM PDT by solzhenitsyn ("Live Not By Lies")
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To: Dog Gone
I was committed to staying while there was work I could do. But, with things deteriorating, it looks like there will be nothing really to be done. I'm getting out next week, before the panic gets too bad and it becomes impossible to even leave the apartment.
10 posted on 04/26/2003 7:35:05 AM PDT by Ma Li (Never confuse excess of information for freedom of information)
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To: Ma Li
I chat almost daily with a young lady in Wenzhou in the Zhejiang providence and she is concerned(which is understandable) about her well being. She doesn't go in to details but I can tell from our conversations she has concern.

I try and give her a picture of what is going on and she seems fairly well informed about the situation.

She has restricted her movements on her own for her own protection.

She is a little apprehensive now because she just returned from Guangzhou(?) providence about 7 days ago from a business trip she cut short because of the situation.

Thanks for your report and I'll watch for any new developments you may have.

11 posted on 04/26/2003 8:30:09 AM PDT by depenzz
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To: Ma Li
Thank you for the report.

I think you are wise to leave while you still can.

12 posted on 04/26/2003 8:30:24 AM PDT by Gritty
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To: Ma Li
Providence = province
13 posted on 04/26/2003 8:33:23 AM PDT by depenzz
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To: Ma Li
Thanks for your post, and for your courage.

I hope "Getting out next week" means MONDAY. Seriously. Your ability to travel could vanish without warning.
14 posted on 04/26/2003 8:52:27 AM PDT by EternalHope (Boycott everything French forever.)
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To: Thud
ping
15 posted on 04/26/2003 9:42:33 AM PDT by Dark Wing
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To: Ma Li; Enemy Of The State; Judith Anne; Mother Abigail; CathyRyan; per loin; Dog Gone; Petronski; ..
Thanks for the report. Good luck getting out.
16 posted on 04/26/2003 9:42:54 AM PDT by aristeides
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To: Dog Gone

Ma Li
Since Apr 18, 2003

view home page, enter name:
Just a conservative American living in communist China! One big party!
Somebody with the misspelled name of a American massacre posting a scare article. This isn't zook who has been here since 98.
17 posted on 04/26/2003 9:49:28 AM PDT by Nov3
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To: Ma Li

Thanks, good information.
18 posted on 04/26/2003 9:52:01 AM PDT by Malsua
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To: Ma Li; aristeides
Thank you very much Ma Li. You will be in my prayers...
19 posted on 04/26/2003 9:52:47 AM PDT by Judith Anne
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To: TominPA
I wonder, could "SARS" be a Chinese BIO weapon experiment that "got out of the bottle?" Just a thought.......

This has been thouroughly debunked weeks ago.
The Pravda report that is was a measels/mumps cross was totally bogus.

The NIH has gene sequenced the virus and it is a simple Coronavirus. That is the common cold virus. It mutates constantly and there are hundreds of new variants out of China every year. This time we just got a really deadly one.

There is no indication that anyone anywhere has ever even considered using a Coronavirus for biowarfare. The virus mutates too quickly, that is the reason we have never had a vaccine for the common cold. There is no way anyone could protect their own population or troops because they couldn't develop an effective vaccination.

The more highly developed a nations healthcare, the less they will be harmed by SARS. Therefore the United States and Western Europe will gain in relative position over the rest of the world, and would be the only ones to profit.

The only even semirational biowar scenario would be if this were a NATO attack on the 3rd world.

SO9

20 posted on 04/26/2003 10:00:29 AM PDT by Servant of the Nine (Think of it as Evolution In Action)
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